Kawasaki 1400 GTR

Off Topic => General Discussion => Topic started by: snowy on May 26, 2016, 02:39:40 PM

Title: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 26, 2016, 02:39:40 PM
Why are we being fed the same untruths from both sides, the leave and stay camps?   :undecided:
I'm really split, head and heart sort of thing.   :sad:
See on the ADV forum theres a sorta poll going on, can we do the same?
No essays on history - just bullet points to help guide a confused and undecided motorcyclist!   
Heart says get out before we loose anything that's left in the leaking bucket of this once "Great Britain"!
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 26, 2016, 03:00:10 PM
Stay in.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on May 26, 2016, 04:36:28 PM
ooooo...politics, religion and forums generally don't mix well at all.  :no: 

OUT
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: stoketim on May 26, 2016, 04:49:48 PM
shake it all about
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on May 26, 2016, 05:37:42 PM
I'm for out (you do see the flag I fly)  not that my opinion matters here.  The US wouldn't stand for it.....I think.....if it were going to happen to US.  Present administration excepted...
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Boomer on May 26, 2016, 06:48:36 PM
I'm for staying in.
You don't get a divorce when your marriage is having problems.
You discuss it and identify the problems and compromise to reach an agreement.

So many of the out campaigners keep banging on about the problems the EU has.
Well, if you see a problem, why not try and fix it rather than preaching about running away?

I agree that it's time for a big change in the EU.
I disagree that change should be for the UK to leave.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: shaggs147 on May 26, 2016, 08:26:40 PM
Out for me..... nothing to do with immigration etc, just the fact that  it seems to become over bloated with rules and regulations and probably costing a fortune paying people to sit on their arse in the euro parliament. All for a closer Europe, but don't see the need to pay the amount we do in. Keep it simple with free trade agreements.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: viper on May 26, 2016, 10:24:26 PM
Turkeys possible and eventual entry into europe will be a big decider for me .
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: BigAlan on May 26, 2016, 10:32:49 PM
Has to be out for me, simply fed up of Brussels interfering into what I think should be our affairs, forget immigration etc but for some unelected outfit to get in excess of £350m per day from us I think is not good value for money.

Out out out.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 27, 2016, 09:22:24 AM
Out for me. For more reasons than I really want to think about...yeah definitely out.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on May 27, 2016, 05:08:48 PM
OUT
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on May 27, 2016, 06:13:27 PM
Hope that if you decide what to do, you had some objective information...
From central europe here, Flanders, we know already that we have lost a bit of making our 'own' decisions...
The bigger you are , the more difficult it is for doing all things very well for everybody...
Guess we need an union that make global decisions, but leave some power too to the countries also... Kind of usa and their states ...
But on the other hand, on the continent, we see also more the advantages in daily use...
When going abroad, what is very close everywhere here, no borders, no limited buys, feel free , not always have to think to change money and pay a lot of bankmargins and costs on that, not need for extra administration, passports, visa etc...  Also for business to export and bring goods abroad... What documents we once needed to send things abroad...
We , born in the 60s, know bout old times,  but the teenagers and young adults dont know  bout that world and cant imagine european world should be parted again in little pieces...

But i understand that since you already have a great and big country with a really nice history too, and cause of being in an isle , you sometimes feel less the need to be united in some way...
For strangers you will always stay a big country that has much power, even in europe, ...

Anyway, i have understood that you already have make your statement by the PM that you will always have a special treatment to keep your own identity within europe .
Good luck and we will always stay your friends anyway 👍😎


Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 27, 2016, 06:28:14 PM
On reflection I think we should leave politics out of the forum.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on May 27, 2016, 07:03:54 PM
We do on the boards (C14) that I directly manage on the US forum, but we do have boards where that's allowed as long as it stays civil.  If not they get moved to an undisclosed location...  This General Discussion board here is where I think it should be but that's up to the powers that be.  Our discussions usually get quite heated and then off they go.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 27, 2016, 07:36:24 PM
Quote from: virginiajim on May 27, 2016, 07:03:54 PM
We do on the boards (C14) that I directly manage on the US forum, but we do have boards where that's allowed as long as it stays civil.  If not they get moved to an undisclosed location...  This General Discussion board here is where I think it should be but that's up to the powers that be.  Our discussions usually get quite heated and then off they go.

:agree:, politics and religion can cause some heated arguments, and in general I do not like to see them on a biking forum, however, I think this referendum is a pretty unique moment for the UK, I was born in the 40's so remember the last world war and the times from that war to how we rebuilt our country. Times were hard for many years, but we survived. I just hate the project fear arguments that are being used on both sides, but primarily on the in campaign side. The only answer is do your own research, the facts are there.....on my research I am definitely in the OUT camp.
Always happy to discuss over a coffee  :mfr_lol:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 27, 2016, 10:19:01 PM
Keep ingoing I say! 👍 so many heart felt opinions posted up - and so good of beegee to post up an opinion from another Eu country! Long live free speech. Good on ya!

Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: davetherave on May 27, 2016, 11:01:43 PM
OUT !!

£350.000000 per week paid in by us.  (we could pay off the national debt off or pay for a hospital every week).
Too many foreign people in this country for the wrong reasons (I'm not a racist, both my daughters in law are foreign and I have no problem with professional foreign workers bringing there needed skills into the country).

Being told what to do by Brussels
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on May 27, 2016, 11:01:53 PM
Maybe so nonbikers can learn from the united bikersworld  :punk: :banana:

Quote from: snowr0 on May 27, 2016, 10:19:01 PM
Keep ingoing I say! 👍 so many heart felt opinions posted up - and so good of beegee to post up an opinion from another Eu country! Long live free speech. Good on ya!

Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 28, 2016, 05:22:48 AM
And this 350,000,000 monthly paid out thing, does anyone know how much we get back? Surely subsidies and development funds must see a big portion coming back? If not then yes, OUT -  education, NHS and public service need some of that!

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Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 28, 2016, 08:33:10 AM
It actually 161m
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 28, 2016, 08:37:02 AM
That sounds better, but would be good the statements!

Sent from my D6603 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 28, 2016, 09:00:59 AM
Figures taken from the Bbc Then they are talking about spending 150 billion on a nuclear deterrent. Now that is a real waste of money. I have not got the figures but we also get a lot back from Europe excluding all the trade benefits.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Burchy on May 28, 2016, 10:18:07 AM
Quote from: davetherave on May 27, 2016, 11:01:43 PM
OUT !!

£350.000000 per week paid in by us.  (we could pay off the national debt off or pay for a hospital every week).
Too many foreign people in this country for the wrong reasons (I'm not a racist, both my daughters in law are foreign and I have no problem with professional foreign workers bringing there needed skills into the country).

Being told what to do by Brussels

to put the National Debt into context (its £1.56 trillion) it would take 85 years to pay it off at £350M a week :cool:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 28, 2016, 11:21:53 AM
To put the payment into context the 350 million is a fairly accurate gross figure, by the time subsidies are paid back ( out of our gross contribution) we pay a nett figure of 8.5 million into the EU coffers.

Currently there are 28 member states and only two member states actually pay a nett contribution and they are Germany and the UK.

Greece, France, Spain, Portugal, Nederlands, Belgium and many others are in Bail out, so effectively contribute nothing. We buy far more from European countries than than we sell to them, currently 40% of our exports go to the EU, 60% worldwide. Would thos European Nations really stop trading with us if we were to leave? I think not. The reasons posted above should be enough to make you vote out, but if you dig deeper it is not hard to find many, many reasons to vote out.

The UK will not disappear if we leave Europe, even the in campaign have said that wages would go up and house prices would come down....I could go on but I think I have said enough   :listencarefully:   :censored:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 28, 2016, 11:42:27 AM
We need to stay in for trade and other reasons. Our economy would worsen if we left. I have said enough too now. Nice day outside shame I'm working.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 28, 2016, 01:47:52 PM
Quote from: iamkwackers on May 28, 2016, 11:21:53 AM
To put the payment into context the 350 million is a fairly accurate gross figure, by the time subsidies are paid back ( out of our gross contribution) we pay a nett figure of 8.5 million into the EU coffers.

The UK will not disappear if we leave Europe, even the in campaign have said that wages would go up and house prices would come down....I could go on but I think I have said enough   :listencarefully:   :censored:
:agree:
Good heavens! Factual, concise and subjective, thought of running for PM? You'd get my vote!
Thanks for the update and good put-over, if only were fed this info and style from those who are supposed to know!   
Glad I started this..............certainly providing food for thought and at present, I must admit it's helping my decision!    :yes:
Ballot papers arrived today! Give it a tad longer in case further good stuff gets put up on here!
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Burchy on May 28, 2016, 09:04:26 PM
Its a bit disengenuous to look at the Norway option as they only have a populaion of 5 million, smaller than some of our cities.  They are just bit players,  The UK however is a major net contributor and would have a real effect on the EU budget if we leave.

I do believe that IF we vote to leave it would trigger a PROPER renegotiatiom of our membership, not this mealy mouthed abortion that Cameron has achieved
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on May 28, 2016, 10:24:20 PM
Quote from: Burchy on May 28, 2016, 09:04:26 PM
Its a bit disengenuous to look at the Norway option as they only have a populaion of 5 million, smaller than some of our cities.  They are just bit players,  The UK however is a major net contributor and would have a real effect on the EU budget if we leave.

I do believe that IF we vote to leave it would trigger a PROPER renegotiatiom of our membership, not this mealy mouthed abortion that Cameron has achieved

5 million is a rounding error and they're frozen most of the time.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on May 28, 2016, 10:35:09 PM
Quote from: Burchy on May 28, 2016, 09:04:26 PM

I do believe that IF we vote to leave it would trigger a PROPER renegotiatiom of our membership, not this mealy mouthed abortion that Cameron has achieved

Sir - the cut of your jib is most respected............top stuff!   :punk:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 29, 2016, 11:57:42 AM
 :agree:  :agree:  :agree:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on May 29, 2016, 01:10:10 PM
and if there is an out vote, I wonder how long it would take to implement that decision 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 30, 2016, 12:01:40 PM
Quote from: O.C. on May 29, 2016, 01:10:10 PM
and if there is an out vote, I wonder how long it would take to implement that decision 

It will take a couple of years to get everything in place. Trading will still carry on,they sell more to us than us to them. The EU is in major decline economically and in my view will implode anyway in the not too distant future, if the EU superstate is not put in place beforehand. The drive is definitely for ever closer union and the eventual formation of a Federal Europe, with it's own Army and centralised parliament, which will rule supreme over all member states. The main protagonists in this cannot allow us to renegotiate new terms as this would thwart their ambitions, plus there would be more countries wanting new terms. Our 8,5 million pounds per day nett contribution, along with Germany's contributions is all that is keeping the EU afloat financially, so of course they do not want us leaving the club. It was interesting to hear the Finance Minister from Greece state that if the UK left the EU, he did not think there would be an economic problem for thje UK, he wants us to stay in the EU to try and help Greece to get the rules changed in order to stop the further Federalisation of Europe. He also felt that without change the EU Economic situation wll further decline to possibly a point of self implosion.

So if we vote out ( and I feel now is the time to do that, before we get dragged down by the failing EU policies) We face a couple of years of renegotiations that would unshackle us from the undemocratic rulings and Federal tendencies of the EU. Financially we will be better off ( we will not be paying 350 million a day to the EU coffers), we can ease the pressure on our infrastructure ( Housing, Hospitals, Schools, the NHS) and create trade deals with the commonwealth countries and the rest of the world without the hinderance of the EU bureacrats.
America will trade with whoever gives them the best deal....currently China....forget the special relationship, it is only there when it suits America.

Two years of hard work to get our country back......seems a good deal to me and for my children and their children....
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on May 30, 2016, 12:41:01 PM
Thank you for that excellent explanation.

I have, for some time, felt the the U.K is such a powerful force within the EU and would be very much missed if we were to opt out, for example the fact that London is a massive worldwide financial centre does in itself demonstrate that other EU countries are heavily dependent on London and its financial centre.

Inevitably and 'out' vote would be beneficial to some and painful to others, in other words it's simply not possible to please all the people all the time.

I too believe that the EU has become unwieldy, extremely costly and increasingly inefficient, it's only a matter of time before it 'disappears up its own backside'

Personally I have delayed my decision regarding in or out for some time, the constant and increasing peddling of lies and exaggeration by both sides has made it difficult to decipher  the facts from the fiction, I have recently decided that the best option is to vote OUT 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 30, 2016, 02:21:20 PM
 :clap:  :clap:  :clap:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Biggestdog007 on May 30, 2016, 03:17:10 PM
Its a definite OUT vote for me, i must say that i am particularly embarrassed with some of the tripe the remain campaign have come out with, especially Cameron.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 30, 2016, 06:32:28 PM
But how will it effect tumble dryers?
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Charlie farley on May 30, 2016, 06:56:12 PM
Quote from: PRD on May 30, 2016, 06:32:28 PM
But how will it effect tumble dryers?
That is a very important point and one that needs an answer , to whom should I instruct  piggy to send an urgent missive .  :mfr_lol:
Is there a minister for laundry orientated white goods ?
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: moayling on May 30, 2016, 07:03:00 PM
Quote from: iamkwackers on May 30, 2016, 12:01:40 PM
It will take a couple of years to get everything in place. Trading will still carry on,they sell more to us than us to them. The EU is in major decline economically and in my view will implode anyway in the not too distant future, if the EU superstate is not put in place beforehand. The drive is definitely for ever closer union and the eventual formation of a Federal Europe, with it's own Army and centralised parliament, which will rule supreme over all member states. The main protagonists in this cannot allow us to renegotiate new terms as this would thwart their ambitions, plus there would be more countries wanting new terms. Our 8,5 million pounds per day nett contribution, along with Germany's contributions is all that is keeping the EU afloat financially, so of course they do not want us leaving the club. It was interesting to hear the Finance Minister from Greece state that if the UK left the EU, he did not think there would be an economic problem for thje UK, he wants us to stay in the EU to try and help Greece to get the rules changed in order to stop the further Federalisation of Europe. He also felt that without change the EU Economic situation wll further decline to possibly a point of self implosion.

So if we vote out ( and I feel now is the time to do that, before we get dragged down by the failing EU policies) We face a couple of years of renegotiations that would unshackle us from the undemocratic rulings and Federal tendencies of the EU. Financially we will be better off ( we will not be paying 350 million a day to the EU coffers), we can ease the pressure on our infrastructure ( Housing, Hospitals, Schools, the NHS) and create trade deals with the commonwealth countries and the rest of the world without the hinderance of the EU bureacrats.
America will trade with whoever gives them the best deal....currently China....forget the special relationship, it is only there when it suits America.

Two years of hard work to get our country back......seems a good deal to me and for my children and their children....

Blimey Syd, You've turned all sensible since buying the GTR. Not used to this.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on May 31, 2016, 10:10:56 AM
Quote from: moayling on May 30, 2016, 07:03:00 PM
Blimey Syd, You've turned all sensible since buying the GTR. Not used to this.

Sorry Mo, just off to get my silly stupid head back on   :wacko:  :wacko:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on May 31, 2016, 03:10:17 PM
https://youtu.be/UTMxfAkxfQ0
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on May 31, 2016, 06:32:43 PM
Quote from: Debs on May 31, 2016, 03:10:17 PM
https://youtu.be/UTMxfAkxfQ0
propaganda!
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: GTRpilot on June 01, 2016, 06:15:30 PM
When the plane is on fire and struggling to maintain altitude, it's time to bail....OUT!
But the decision probably won't affect us, it's our kids / children that it will probably affect the most, perhaps we should consult them as to which way they want to go, and vote accordingly  :popcorn:

Still OUT for me though  :whistling:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: SirToU on June 01, 2016, 06:34:26 PM
Sorry, there are arguments for both ways.  but I haven't seen anything that would advise me to vote in...

too many shall and shan't do's coming out of Brussels for me.

So I'll be voting out.... 

Neil
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 01, 2016, 06:37:31 PM
Well, if the vote is for out, how would that affect your PM?  Would be a sure lack of confidence from the people wouldn't it?
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 01, 2016, 06:40:11 PM
Quote from: virginiajim on June 01, 2016, 06:37:31 PM
Well, if the vote is for out, how would that affect your PM?  Would be a sure lack of confidence from the people wouldn't it?

in a words ....yes.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: BigAlan on June 01, 2016, 06:43:27 PM
Quote from: O.C. on June 01, 2016, 06:40:11 PM
in a words ....yes.

What's more our prime minister is my MP.

Alan
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on June 01, 2016, 07:40:55 PM
Quote from: BigAlan on June 01, 2016, 06:43:27 PM
What's more our prime minister is my MP.

Alan
:oops: tough luck... :censored:  :censored:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: snowy on June 08, 2016, 11:19:38 AM
Some good stuff in here......................

There appears to be a lot of misunderstanding about how our votes on June 23rd will impact upon our lives and the way the UK functions in general and people want to gather as much information as possible. Here are some clear facts if you are contemplating casting your vote in hope of us leaving the EU.
You would not be voting to leave the EEA or WTO, meaning all of the UK's trade and benefit agreements will remain unchanged should we leave, until such a time that the UK decides to renegotiate them for any reason.

You would not be voting to leave NATO, meaning our security agreements remain unchanged. Should we receive an act of hostility from a non-NATO member, then NATO countries are obliged to come to our assistance. This does not change.

You would not be voting to leave the UN, G8 or G20, meaning Britain will have the same voice on the world stage as it does today.
You would not voting to leave Europe!! The UK will still, geographically, be part of Europe. Non political organisations aligned to Europe will still extend membership to the UK (I.e. sports governing bodies, and so on).

You would not be voting to stop the recognition of Interpol, Europol and neither would you be voting for SIS / MI6 to stop dealing with other intelligence services in the fight against terrorism and global, organised crime.
You would not be voting against being able to travel to Europe, contrary to the belief of some fools recently on TV. The UK has always maintained stricter border and passport controls than many EU members. This will not change. You would still use a passport to go on holiday and you would still be allowed entry to countries in Europe. You may even get chance to skip queues by using the non--EU queues at the airport (the only point so far that is my opinion, and not necessarily a fact).

The UK economy will benefit to the tune of £billions in the first year if we leave.
Medical and science research will not simply stop. The UK pays into the EU to then get money back in the form of funding. The UK will now be in control of this money and can choose to fund whatever UK based medical, science, art or other research it chooses.

Farming will not lose money because of EU funding being cut. The UK negotiated a rebate of some monies that the UK pays to the EU, in order to subsidise UK farmers. Instead of asking for our money back, we can give it straight to farmers. No change there.

You are not voting against human rights. The EU Convention on, and European Court of Human Rights are not part of the EU. Until parliament passes a new bill of rights for the UK, these will still apply, as will precedents already passed down to UK courts from Brussels.

You are not voting to kick anyone out of the UK or block access to anyone. Neither are you voting to stop recruiting valuable European workers into things like the NHS. Like my other point about passports for travel, the UK is already outside of the Schengen zone and so migrant workers must enter the UK with a valid passport before and after June 23rd. That will not change. British borders maintain full control of who comes and goes. Should someone have the skills to apply to work in the NHS, then they will still be permitted travel and given an opportunity to apply for a job. Worst case, points based assessment, like the US, Canada and Australia use, will come into effect. The UK is likely to negotiate freedom of labour movement though, in exchange for freedom of goods movement.

You are not voting to move jobs nor production out of the UK! The EU actually helped fund the move of Ford Transit production from the UK to Turkey... Yes, the EU helped give UK jobs to people in Turkey by giving Ford a loan of £80m with very generous terms!

What you are voting for is UK sovereignty. You are voting to stay in or leave a political union of leaders and representatives that you British people did not elect. You are voting against a commission of unelected, elite men that nobody at all voted for and yet they make decisions on our behalf. You are simply voting to bring sovereignty back to Westminster, and that is all. If you worry about that because you don't like the Conservative government, look at the reality. Their majority in parliament is very slim. They have been blocked on big decisions already. You are therefore not giving sovereignty to David Cameron, but to the UK House of elected representatives. Do not be fooled by the fear campaigns that are simply run by the wealthy, who need EU money to thrive!

Think about the future, and your family's future. Spread the word. Feel free to share.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: moayling on June 08, 2016, 12:17:23 PM
  :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Phill_York on June 08, 2016, 12:19:39 PM
Wise words  :agree:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 08, 2016, 01:17:14 PM
Excellent and that dispels all the myth that is being spread by those who want to stay in the EU because it benefits them to do so....I'm thinking National and international banking organisations, and we have all experienced how patriotic they have been in the past ! 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Winston Smith on June 08, 2016, 03:25:33 PM
Both In and Out can put up similar arguments for and against.

Even Cameron and Farage on the EU debate program blurred over one anothers lines!

We should NOT be having this referendum - end of.

It is only because we have weak leadership of the country that it is occurring. We vote for the government, and they should make these decisions as they have access to the true experts and all the facts surrounding the UK and it's membership.

All I would say is that voting Out means we're running from the issues and will have no say in European decisions that may effect us
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on June 08, 2016, 05:04:18 PM
Quote from: Winston Smith on June 08, 2016, 03:25:33 PM
Both In and Out can put up similar arguments for and against.

Even Cameron and Farage on the EU debate program blurred over one anothers lines!

We should NOT be having this referendum - end of.

It is only because we have weak leadership of the country that it is occurring. We vote for the government, and they should make these decisions as they have access to the true experts and all the facts surrounding the UK and it's membership.i agree.

All I would say is that voting Out means we're running from the issues and will have no say in European decisions that may effect us
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on June 08, 2016, 05:05:24 PM
I agree with winston. We should stay in.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Rusty on June 08, 2016, 10:01:56 PM
Sorry I am so late to this thread .... Its very simple ... go and make yourself a cup of tea or coffee ... get onto You Tube and watch "Brexit The Movie" .. 1hr and 10 minutes of your time.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: SirToU on June 09, 2016, 08:18:37 AM
I don't agree that we shouldn't be voting - Just on the basis we don't have the right experts.

research the information and make yourself an expert!   also, what happened to elections and choice.

whether you like the current establishment or not - "the royal we"  choose this government.... as the "the royal we" should choose to vote on Europe.

Thats the way it should work (and yes to a certain extent it doesn't) but thats the how this country supposedly works - if you don't want to that life - China, Russia + others are only a flight away!  :-)

Neil
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Longtom on June 09, 2016, 09:47:23 AM
Quote from: Rusty on June 08, 2016, 10:01:56 PM
Sorry I am so late to this thread .... Its very simple ... go and make yourself a cup of tea or coffee ... get onto You Tube and watch "Brexit The Movie" .. 1hr and 10 minutes of your time.
:agree:An excellent suggestion.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on June 09, 2016, 10:26:46 AM
But can you believe the film makers!!
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: iamkwackers on June 09, 2016, 11:24:38 AM
Quote from: PRD on June 09, 2016, 10:26:46 AM
But can you believe the film makers!!

Do your own research, but always ask yourself at the end of the research sessions.....Do I want to belong to a club that is failing economically, that wants to initiate a federal european state, with a federal army, do I want uncontrolled immigration/migration, do I want a country that cannot keep up with infrastructure demands, do I want our laws superceded by an unelected commission.........or

Do I want to live in a country that has democratic rule, sovereignty over its own laws and borders, that is free to trade world wide and spend the benefits of that trade on improved infrastructure, sensible agricultural policies, reclaim our fishing industry, control immigration to sensible levels.

Surely, Control of your own destiny has to be the right choice........

Oh yes, do you really think that BMW would stop trading with us if we left !!!....of course not, where else are they going to find so many suckers for punishment   :mfr_lol:  :mfr_lol:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Phill_York on June 09, 2016, 11:26:30 AM
I'm still in the middle but swinging towards Brexit for a number of reasons but mainly around wanting a stable economy and not being able to control how many people come into your country will not give us stability.  I am glad we're having a referendum as leaving the vote to the establishment is asking Turkeys to vote for Christmas.

I'm not trying to persuade anyone but when we're out of the EU and operating under WTO rules, Japanese (ie properly designed and reliable) motorcycles will be the same price or cheaper and EU manufactured machines (ie unreliable, already overpriced) will get more expensive; if that doesn't change your mind, nothing will  :banana:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: ChrisB on June 09, 2016, 04:24:03 PM
Most messages make sense here and though I will be voting out, it is not for the reasons/half truths provided by the politicians. I want to be English and not European, I want to take responsibility for me and mine. The Government destroyed the financial services industry by poorly implementing EU requirements for a fairer market place. Those requirements have always been too complicated and expensive to employ. And I worked in Compliance, NOT sales.
On a lighter note, you can always tell when a politician is lying.............................................
his lips move.http://www.gtr1400.co.uk/forums/Smileys/default/grin.gif
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: UncleBigBad on June 09, 2016, 09:23:00 PM
I'm voting out purely because I think Mr Cameron is a numpty and I'm sick of all the blah blah blah from all sides.  I long for the day when Boris Johnson is Mayor of London, Jeremy Clarkson is PM and Ade Edmondson is Chancellor of the Exchequer (even if only for a few days)

Truth be told, I think everybody needs to do their own research and reading, and make their own views on the subject. Personally I'm sitting in the Brexit camp so that we can retain some of the money we pay into the EU each year, we can manage our own trade and farming deals, and we can maintain an effective immigration policy. Agree wholeheartedly with other comments about us having access to the right people with the right skills from wherever they hail, but we do (IMHO) need to maintain our borders.

I think that no matter what the outcome, any real changes will take years to take effect
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on June 22, 2016, 10:23:10 PM
Brexit means the 4 british teams will leave the EC Football from tomorrow ....?
Pity :wacko:

Brrr... Anyway its very close... Imagine Usa, the germanies, ... Would go apart again instead of being united..
Maybe we will have another world from next weekend...

Even when stay together, , the UK got special conditions within the EU lately so have more freedom anyway. Would change EU already and prob other countries could follow that idea...
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 23, 2016, 07:13:59 AM
A little apt music for the day  :mfr_lol: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqH21LEmfbQ
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 23, 2016, 01:05:21 PM
Quote from: beegee on June 22, 2016, 10:23:10 PM
Brexit means the 4 british teams will leave the EC Football from tomorrow ....?
Pity :wacko:

Brrr... Anyway its very close... Imagine Usa, the germanies, ... Would go apart again instead of being united..
Maybe we will have another world from next weekend...

Even when stay together, , the UK got special conditions within the EU lately so have more freedom anyway. Would change EU already and prob other countries could follow that idea...

Yeah, I think we had a war over that one and places are still trying to secede from the Union.  Comes up every once in awhile.  It be like Scotland or Wales trying to leave.  The biggest fear over here is the stock market but I don't know why that is.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on June 23, 2016, 05:08:21 PM
Guess its because economics will go worse. Economics expect national product will decrease 4 to 8 % cause of much more costs.  When UK is not europe , import taxes in EU are 10% eg...   Exportdocuments, export/import limitations for business but for individuals too,  etc... Will cause more unemployment, more taxes for the citizens etc..
So stock markets are expected to fall 10/20% for the start , £ also....
Ps half of all british export goes to the EU...

Same reasons for european stocks to fall, less and more expensive business with UK, so stocks will fall to.  Even usa and other world stocks cause it s a precedent ... Other countries and states can follow....

Hope all goes better than this ....


"Yeah, I think we had a war over that one and places are still trying to secede from the Union.  Comes up every once in awhile.  It be like Scotland or Wales trying to leave.  The biggest fear over here is the stock market but I don't know why that is.
[/quote]"
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 23, 2016, 06:50:37 PM
there has been much speculation and predictions about what may happen if we vote to leave the EU

Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 23, 2016, 07:37:17 PM
We'll find out soon enough, I guess.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 23, 2016, 11:12:17 PM
Well, when will you know?
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 24, 2016, 09:24:09 AM
Quote from: virginiajim on June 23, 2016, 11:12:17 PM
Well, when will you know?


RESULTS
52% OUT
48% REMAIN

P.M Resigns in October
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Lonewolf on June 24, 2016, 09:38:34 AM
Common sense has prevailed!  :clap:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 24, 2016, 10:51:08 AM
I just heard it on the news.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on June 24, 2016, 12:52:12 PM
Quote from: The Wolf on June 24, 2016, 09:38:34 AM
Common sense has prevailed!  :clap:

So much scaremongering on social media of people saying the UK is broken and hateful, and they are going to leave. Well if they need help packing I will help.

This was never about dividing people or being racist. It was about taking back control.

Yes I voted out. I did this for all the men and women who died during 2 world wars to keep this country great. They gave their lives for us, and to stay in the EU would be like a kick in the teeth for them.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: GTRpilot on June 24, 2016, 01:50:37 PM
Quote from: Debs on June 24, 2016, 12:52:12 PM
So much scaremongering on social media of people saying the UK is broken and hateful, and they are going to leave. Well if they need help packing I will help.

This was never about dividing people or being racist. It was about taking back control.

Yes I voted out. I did this for all the men and women who died during 2 world wars to keep this country great. They gave their lives for us, and to stay in the EU would be like a kick in the teeth for them.

Can't argue with that. Welcome to Independence day  :yes:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 24, 2016, 01:50:48 PM
Quote from: Debs on June 24, 2016, 12:52:12 PM
So much scaremongering on social media of people saying the UK is broken and hateful, and they are going to leave. Well if they need help packing I will help.

This was never about dividing people or being racist. It was about taking back control.

Yes I voted out. I did this for all the men and women who died during 2 world wars to keep this country great. They gave their lives for us, and to stay in the EU would be like a kick in the teeth for them.


:clap: :clap: 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: gpink on June 24, 2016, 02:38:40 PM
I wish you all the best going forward. Always vote for freedom.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on June 24, 2016, 05:55:05 PM
Meaning all States would be apart again ?

Or making new borders now from UK to Continent...?
With more importtaxes, limits, documents, much time lost for individuals and companies.
National bank say they are ready to put 300.000.000.000 £ to put in financial system...  I wonder who will pay for that
European financial centre will be frankfurt, many british companies were ready to buy businessground or plants on the continent to keep business going in case off, ...
On the short term it will only cost money, cause money that goes to EU will not be reduced immediately and for all...   
Search for more than 50 hard obtained agreements with non european countries cause no part anymore of existing ones frome EU...
Hope on the long term it can go better cause of £ will be much more cheaper for foreign countries...

Quote from: gpink on June 24, 2016, 02:38:40 PM
I wish you all the best going forward. Always vote for freedom.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 24, 2016, 07:37:04 PM
Quote from: gpink on June 24, 2016, 02:38:40 PM
I wish you all the best going forward. Always vote for freedom.

You can move around, but you can't hide...welcome!
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on June 24, 2016, 08:11:48 PM
(http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y411/bikergirl1400/13432426_1047522281951385_6167851420491084649_n_zpspbmqmsef.jpg) (http://s1273.photobucket.com/user/bikergirl1400/media/13432426_1047522281951385_6167851420491084649_n_zpspbmqmsef.jpg.html)
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 24, 2016, 08:50:16 PM
yep I'm with you Debs, what's the point in stressing about something you can't change
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 24, 2016, 08:53:42 PM
I feel that way about myself sometimes..I mean....I just can't drink Gin anymore.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 24, 2016, 08:56:16 PM
Jim at this very moment I'm enjoying a Bushmills whiskey   :clap:   
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 24, 2016, 09:57:01 PM
Well, have one for me and I'll have one for you and the gang...I'm thinking Scotch tonight.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on June 25, 2016, 05:07:54 AM
(http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y411/bikergirl1400/13529096_291804487821973_9170883959406904393_n_zpsorqqab3w.jpg) (http://s1273.photobucket.com/user/bikergirl1400/media/13529096_291804487821973_9170883959406904393_n_zpsorqqab3w.jpg.html)
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Charlie747 on June 25, 2016, 06:56:45 AM
Quote from: gpink on June 24, 2016, 02:38:40 PM
I wish you all the best going forward. Always vote for freedom.

:185:  from Lincolnshire  :punk:

Took yer time finding us lot over here  :mfr_lol:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 25, 2016, 09:39:54 AM
Quote from: gpink on June 24, 2016, 02:38:40 PM
I wish you all the best going forward. Always vote for freedom.

Welcome along, I see you joined the forum quite a long time ago, don't leave it so long to post again  :clap:   
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 25, 2016, 10:51:30 AM
He's one of our local Twits.  Good to see him branching out.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 25, 2016, 11:46:50 AM
 :mfr_lol: 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: gpink on June 25, 2016, 02:14:47 PM
Thanks for the welcome. Being a 'twit' over here in the colonies is easy but I haven't wanted to step on my d**k in front of the elders in my ancestral homeland.  :cool:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Debs on June 25, 2016, 03:44:33 PM
(http://i1273.photobucket.com/albums/y411/bikergirl1400/thumbs-up03_zpsbons1xci.jpg) (http://s1273.photobucket.com/user/bikergirl1400/media/thumbs-up03_zpsbons1xci.jpg.html)
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 25, 2016, 07:33:30 PM
Quote from: gpink on June 25, 2016, 02:14:47 PM
Thanks for the welcome. Being a 'twit' over here in the colonies is easy but I haven't wanted to step on my d**k in front of the elders in my ancestral homeland.  :cool:


:mfr_lol: I  can see that you are gonna fit right in on here  :clap:   
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: beegee on June 25, 2016, 09:13:59 PM
Welcome gpink :punk:
Enjoy this forum..    Oops you already did :mfr_lol:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 26, 2016, 01:52:53 PM
Quote from: gpink on June 25, 2016, 02:14:47 PM
Thanks for the welcome. Being a 'twit' over here in the colonies is easy but I haven't wanted to step on my d**k in front of the elders in my ancestral homeland.  :cool:


When has that stopped you?  :mfr_lol:
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: gpink on June 26, 2016, 02:09:28 PM
Stopped what ... being a twit or stepping on it? See there you go Jim, got the thread off topic. Who's the sword swinger we have watch out for here?
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: O.C. on June 26, 2016, 02:11:16 PM
Can't imagine   :whistling: 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: virginiajim on June 26, 2016, 02:37:30 PM
Certainly not me.  I'm just one Bozo on a bus.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: PRD on January 01, 2019, 09:34:35 AM
Quote from: O.C. on May 30, 2016, 12:41:01 PM
Thank you for that excellent explanation.

I have, for some time, felt the the U.K is such a powerful force within the EU and would be very much missed if we were to opt out, for example the fact that London is a massive worldwide financial centre does in itself demonstrate that other EU countries are heavily dependent on London and its financial centre.

Inevitably and 'out' vote would be beneficial to some and painful to others, in other words it's simply not possible to please all the people all the time.

I too believe that the EU has become unwieldy, extremely costly and increasingly inefficient, it's only a matter of time before it 'disappears up its own backside'

Personally I have delayed my decision regarding in or out for some time, the constant and increasing peddling of lies and exaggeration by both sides has made it difficult to decipher  the facts from the fiction, I have recently decided that the best option is to vote OUT 
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Rusty on February 04, 2019, 08:40:18 PM
WOW !! I see this thread was started in 2016 and only has 7 pages .... there is a similar thread on the dark side forum that I use titled "Warning Brexit Thread" .. its not very old and is currently on page 515  :eek: :eek: :eek:

Some of the chaps over there are not quite as polite to each other as they are here !
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Lonewolf on February 05, 2019, 12:56:04 AM
Quote from: Rusty on February 04, 2019, 08:40:18 PM
WOW !! I see this thread was started in 2016 and only has 7 pages .... there is a similar thread on the dark side forum that I use titled "Warning Brexit Thread" .. its not very old and is currently on page 515  :eek: :eek: :eek:

Some of the chaps over there are not quite as polite to each other as they are here !


Lol, I've seen that thread and I need to set aside a couple of days to read it.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: mcfroyce44 on February 05, 2019, 01:29:15 PM
Out for me too. As quickly as possible. The original idea of a common market was good. Taken too far and now having your PM needing to ask approval for your country's budget isn't on.
As a resident of NI, I have dual citizenship and two passports, British and Irish. Post Brexit, I can be A Brit when it suits and a Paddy when that's better.
Title: Re: while we're talking Europe.........................
Post by: Rusty on February 05, 2019, 08:29:59 PM
Nice one 44 :clap: