Hi folks
Noticed yesterday I have a little white residue in the oil filler cap but oil in the sump is black as normal. Couple of people have said a bit of white residue is normal but just wanted your opinions! Should I do oil and filter change?
On a seperate note. I have a little noise when starting from cold. Last no more than a second. Read a few of the threads on here and leads me to suspect its cam tensioner (or something along those lines?). Its quite an off putting noise and the garage said don't worry about it too much for now. Are they right to say this?? Last thing I want is engine failure!
Cheers folks.
white residue on your filler cap usually points to head gasket (water in your oil) dont know if your bike has been run much ,but if your bike has been laid up for a while you will get the white residue build up on your cap, and fogging up of your glass oil level indicator lens ,as mine was but once you take it out for a good run you will find that your glass lens will clear and the cap will be clean, i have had this on a lot of bikes when they haven't been run for a while. fingers crossed and hope thats all it is and not your head gasket good luck.
Yeah it sounds like it might just be due to condensation. Has the bike been stood up for a while over winter? ........ As for the noise, it could be from the cam chain as you say. Mine rattles for a few seconds after starting, and then quietens down. I have read a lot of posts on this and it seems to be fairly common and is due to the oil draining back from the automatic tensioner at standstill as far as I'm aware.
Hi,
Newbie on here myself but your questions aren't really GTR specific but general maintenance so I can help.
The white residue is condensation, do you ride short trips ? or have have been warming the bike up for a while but not riding ? I would change the oil and filter as it's a simple task, please bear in mind that modern oils take around 20 miles to thoughroly to warm up and burn off any condensation.
The noise on start up, my is cam chain but I wouldn't overly worry, most kawasaki's do this but if it bothers you then ask your dealer (if you feel you can trust them). You can buy a aftermaket APE tensioner, this is a mod poular with ZZR owners mostly in the states but as it's the same engine it should fit.
I hope this eases your mind
Do you also notice that the noise goes away within a second or 2 and this coincides with a drop in revs. probably only happens on the first cold start of the day?
I had this on my old GTR and it was low oil pressure until the pump got going and pushed the oil around. The noise went away immediately after an oil change but came back as the oil deteriorated
BTW I would say that black moil in the sump was normal. You really want to see golden or brown oil. Black is full of carbon and needs changing lickety split
The bike is used almost daily but only for 2 seperate 30 minute trips which might explain why I'm not evaporating the condensation. Think I will take it for a long run on saturday followed by oil and filter change next week. Although slightly worried it might be head gasket....any other signs this might be the route cause? At present I have a minor rattle (tapping noise mirrors engine revs) from the front half of the bike (I can't pinpoint the sound exactly), is this linked?
Out of interest if I sent the bike into the garage to get the cam checked or replaced what sort of cost would I be looking at?
Quote from: Burchy on February 25, 2014, 10:15:37 PM
Do you also notice that the noise goes away within a second or 2 and this coincides with a drop in revs. probably only happens on the first cold start of the day?
I had this on my old GTR and it was low oil pressure until the pump got going and pushed the oil around. The noise went away immediately after an oil change but came back as the oil deteriorated
BTW I would say that black moil in the sump was normal. You really want to see golden or brown oil. Black is full of carbon and needs changing lickety split
Yes only when cold! Interesting comments...I'm beginning to think I really need an oil and filter change sooner rather than later! The oil is deep black and the filter looks as if its seen a fair few miles!
I'd do the oil before doing the long run. Its only a 10 minute job.
Sounds like a short trip to BurchyKawasaki might be in order
Given my everyday riding would I be better using fully synthetic or semi synthetic? Cost not an issue, I want the best for the bike! Also inclined to change the oil quite frequently to make sure oil stays prime.
Some emulsification (water & oil ingress) can take place in winter months especially if a bike has been laid up.
The fact is that any amount of water in oil will reduce the oils performance proportionately.
I would recommend that you change the oil and filter and try again, chances are that the noise will reduce/disappear.
When you've heard a noise for the first time you will find that you are listening for it thereafter, and any major problem would be a loud noise anyway :yes:
Oil is black? How long have you had it in there Jon? :nono:
Maybe you have the diesel model :whistling:
Use semi synthetic, the qualities of semi synthetic far out weighs the requirements of the engine. However if you choose to use fully synthetic you wont cause any damage, but you will be wasting your money.
Quote from: The Wolf on February 26, 2014, 09:59:02 PM
Use semi synthetic, the qualities of semi synthetic far out weighs the requirements of the engine. However if you choose to use fully synthetic you wont cause any damage, but you will be wasting your money.
True, unless you got 12 litres of Castrol Power 1 fully synth from Tesco last summer at £2.50 a litre :laugh:
Quote from: Bryn on February 27, 2014, 07:44:39 AM
True, unless you got 12 litres of Castrol Power 1 fully synth from Tesco last summer at £2.50 a litre :laugh:
Very true! :yes:
short bike runs in cold weather will not allow the oil to reach the temp :no: so you will get condensation misting/clouding in the oil glass window :sad: but like a few have already said, a good long run will burn off any condensation :smiley: I often use my bike for work and that's only 5 mile trip which causes condensation and clouds the sight glass, but it's not a big problem and there is no need to change your oil :no: if under your own mileage or time changes :smiley: but if your doing lots of short runs, and taking into consideration that condensation turns to water which is not going to do your oil any favours :no: so after a short rides this time of the year, I unscrew the oil cap and place it loosely on the thread on a slight angle leaving just a few mm so the engine can breath, then after a few hours you will find your sight glass is clear of any clouding or any condensation :banana: just remember to replace your cap before you ride off :whistling:
Picked up some new oil today. Was intending to get Motul 300V fully synthetic. Supplier said it was racing oil and not designed for road use and needed to be changed every couple of thousand miles. So he recommended Motul's best fully synthetic for road use (I forget the actual name). Then I mentioned I was currently running semi synthetic. So he said .... don't replace semi with fully synthetic as it can cause clutch plates to slip in some case and that if I wanted to change to fully synthetic then I should have the clutch plates changed at the same time.
What do you folks think about his comments?
In the end I ended up going for Motuls best semi synthetic (7100 I think it was).
I was really keen to give fully synthetic a go but he really put me off.
using fully synthetic oil as been known to make clutches slip in some bikes that the recommended oil is semi 10/w/40 :yes: that's why we stop using fully synthetic oil in our work bikes, which were Honda's ST1300. I just use a quality 10/w/40 semi which I've always used in all my bikes including my G.T.R 1400 and presently in my zzr1441 :smiley: 10/w/40 semi is the recommended oil and is fine and well up to the job, I change my oil and filter every 2,500 miles and use Castrol G.P.S power 1 with Trizone Technology "extreme protection" 10/w/40 semi synthetic. you would be ok running your bike up to 4,000 miles if your doing long runs most of the time, if your on short runs change it between 2,500 and 3,000 :smiley:
Quote from: jonkawasaki on February 27, 2014, 09:27:30 PM
Picked up some new oil today. Was intending to get Motul 300V fully synthetic. Supplier said it was racing oil and not designed for road use and needed to be changed every couple of thousand miles. So he recommended Motul's best fully synthetic for road use (I forget the actual name). Then I mentioned I was currently running semi synthetic. So he said .... don't replace semi with fully synthetic as it can cause clutch plates to slip in some case and that if I wanted to change to fully synthetic then I should have the clutch plates changed at the same time.
What do you folks think about his comments?
Jonka,
I agree with your dealer Don't do it !!
Other problems with Fully syn is as the oil is "thinner" engine noise can increase (not good when your worried about the camchain) also you will lose the oil "wedge" (stickyness) as 2 kwacks has stated 10w/40 semi is perfectly adequate just change it regulary and it'll be fine, PS I work for Castrol (industrial so not I cannot get oil for bikes) so I have knowledge of lubrication systems and have the ability to contact developement chemists for advice if needed (a few years ago I spent a very interesting evening talking to a chemist about oil for GP bikes after having a tour of the workshop facility, brilliant :clap:
In the end I ended up going for Motuls best semi synthetic (7100 I think it was).
I was really keen to give fully synthetic a go but he really put me off.
Quoting mishap! :oops:
Thanks for the advice though I'm sure it'll work out!
unless I'm very much mistaken motul 10/w/40 7100 is fully synth not semi synth, motul oil is as good as any other, but motul 5100 is the semi synth :yes:
I have run 300V in the GTR before. No issues.
the bike's oil specs say nothing about semi or fully synthetic.
you can run any oil you want in the GTR , as long as its 10W-40 and meets the JASO/MA specs.
.
You simply do not need fully synthetic oil in your bike, its only good for bragging about at bike meets.
If you have been using semi-synthetic then continue to do so and under no circumstances should you mix the two
Modern oils are light years ahead of oils from yesteryear.......................USE SEMI SYNTHETIC :yes:
follow 2kwacks advice..he is correct :agree:
The kawasaki dealer that supplied my bike changed the oil to Motul 300V at around 700 miles, as the "jolt" into first gear became too much for me to bear (my previous BMW was completely smooth). This was done under Warranty, paid for by Kawasaki and the dealer said is one of the recommended fixes if a customer complains of harsh engagement of first gear.
This change transformed the bike, at the next oil change Motul 300V was also used and will be again in the Spring, when the 7,500 mile service becomes due. There has been no oil usage between scheduled services and I definetely feel that the extra cost is justified, at least for me. The clutch (at least on my bike) shows no signs of slip, although before the Motul 300V was used the original oil was, I presume a semi synthetic. Clutch plates have never been changed.
The Kawasaki dealer that I use now offers this oil on scheduled services to GTR owners...
The first dealership which used fully synthetic on mine was Autorama at Batley, they said they always used it. I'd no issue either way and to be honest I had no clutch slip with it and I thought it ran smoother on fully synthetic. I've just replaced my oil and a different dealership said that semi synthetic was just fine so that's what I'm using. Personal choice at the end of the day, but ultimately semi synthetic will more than suffice.
:agree:
I'm going to stick with the semi that I bought yesterday but might try fully synthetic next time I need an oil change. :yes:
Quote from: flatfour on February 28, 2014, 08:55:10 AM
The kawasaki dealer that supplied my bike changed the oil to Motul 300V at around 700 miles, as the "jolt" into first gear became too much for me to bear (my previous BMW was completely smooth). This was done under Warranty, paid for by Kawasaki and the dealer said is one of the recommended fixes if a customer complains of harsh engagement of first gear.
This change transformed the bike, at the next oil change Motul 300V was also used and will be again in the Spring, when the 7,500 mile service becomes due. There has been no oil usage between scheduled services and I definetely feel that the extra cost is justified, at least for me. The clutch (at least on my bike) shows no signs of slip, although before the Motul 300V was used the original oil was, I presume a semi synthetic. Clutch plates have never been changed.
The Kawasaki dealer that I use now offers this oil on scheduled services to GTR owners...
did you I've more than the normal first gear clunk? the reason I'm asking is because, Kawasaki's clunk in first gear :whistling: it's Kawasaki's trade mark :yes: "cluck every trip" :mfr_lol:
Well, the Service Manager tried two other bikes whilst checking mine, and I was there with him. One was a demo, with around 1,700 miles on it, the other a used example with some 9,000 miles showing. The demo was almost silent when engaging gear (as was mine from new, for a short while) and the used bike was similar to mine. They bled the clutch on mine first of all, with no improvement and then one of the tech's said change the oil for fully synthetic, as Kawasaki recommend in these cases.
Following this oil change, the excercise was repeated and mine was almost (but not quite) as quiet as the demo bike. It has stayed the same since. The tech said that the fully synthetic oil flings off the clutch plates more quickly, allowing them to free faster rather than drag.
Quote from: flatfour on February 28, 2014, 06:32:00 PM
Well, the Service Manager tried two other bikes whilst checking mine, and I was there with him. One was a demo, with around 1,700 miles on it, the other a used example with some 9,000 miles showing. The demo was almost silent when engaging gear (as was mine from new, for a short while) and the used bike was similar to mine. They bled the clutch on mine first of all, with no improvement and then one of the tech's said change the oil for fully synthetic, as Kawasaki recommend in these cases.
Following this oil change, the excercise was repeated and mine was almost (but not quite) as quiet as the demo bike. It has stayed the same since. The tech said that the fully synthetic oil flings off the clutch plates more quickly, allowing them to free faster rather than drag.
very interesting indeed :smiley: will do a bit more research into this :yes: are you saying Kawasaki tech department said use fully synth instead of semi synth which will eliminate the first gear clunk. in which case, this begs the question? why Kawasaki didn't use fully synth in the first place, after all... Kawasaki knows about the first gear clunking! this is very confusing :help: :wacko: :laugh:
The tech said that there were a range of "fixes" from kawasaki that were to be applied when a customer complained of harsh engagement of first gear. Bleeding the clutch was first, with a change to fully synthetic oil next.
I suppose that if Kawasaki insisted on fully synthetic oil at service intervals it would increase cost of ownership? When I worked for a vehicle manufacturer some years ago, everything possible was done to achieve the lowest cost per mile figures
Quote from: flatfour on February 28, 2014, 07:32:54 PM
The tech said that there were a range of "fixes" from kawasaki that were to be applied when a customer complained of harsh engagement of first gear. Bleeding the clutch was first, with a change to fully synthetic oil next.
I suppose that if Kawasaki insisted on fully synthetic oil at service intervals it would increase cost of ownership? When I worked for a vehicle manufacturer some years ago, everything possible was done to achieve the lowest cost per mile figures
... wishing I got the fully synthetic now :hammer:
Quote from: jonkawasaki on February 28, 2014, 07:39:55 PM
... wishing I got the fully synthetic now :hammer:
semi syth will be fine in your engine :yes: remember... forums are great for picking up tips, having a laugh and talking bollocks :laugh: but if you take to much noticed of what is said and done to the bikes, it will spend more time in pieces than together :mfr_lol:
Just to add.
I just remembered, you could use a friction modifier, some claim up to 90% less friction and this may help with your issues.
Just remember if you put 250ml of modifier into the engine you may have to drain the same amount of oil out or you may overfill.
Also as somebody mentioned engines and oils have improved massively even over the last few years, as such some of the acronyms like AMO and JASO were originally developed for 1950's american cars which obviously bear no relevence to todays market, an example of this is the "sheer protection" in a modern semi is far superior to older oils which where essentially just pure mineral oils, so much has gone into the developement of modern oils that unless you're a track day rider or want extended life (ie between 4-12k miles) a good semi syn is plenty good enough (if memory serves me correctly even Honda RC30's ran better on shell SS).
You pay your money and make your choice.