I have a problem with baby...
When the engine is running the dipped lights are off, the indicators are stuck on and the main beam dash light is lit..
When I got back home I cut the engine off but left the ignition on as though it was still running... I could hear a buzz from a relay under the near side panel... I have taken this off as was wondering if this is the problem and intend to get a new one... Before I waste my money, does any one else have any idea what the problem could be?
I thought it could be a bad earth from when I fitted the extra lights but they are not effected...
Im dreading a visit to BK as they charge £58 per hour labour.. :sad:
Hi
It does sound like it could be an earth fault
Quote from: Richard on June 13, 2013, 08:29:37 PM
Hi
It does sound like it could be an earth fault
:agree: Debs, check the relay
Its going to be dry on Saturday, so I will have to get it sorted then...
Quote from: olde coney on June 13, 2013, 08:31:50 PM
:agree: Debs, check the relay
OC, How do I check the relay is working?
This is the one.......
TBH, the quickest way is to replace it and see if it sorts the problem Debs :yes:
Debs, maybe its time to let 'Baby' go to the big workshop in the sky. :whistling:
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 08:16:57 PM
I have a problem with baby...
When the engine is running the dipped lights are off, the indicators are stuck on and the main beam dash light is lit..
When I got back home I cut the engine off but left the ignition on as though it was still running... I could hear a buzz from a relay under the near side panel...
When you say indicators stuck on you mean just alight, no flashing?
All of them?
Is that the realy that was buzzing?
Which one is it looking at
http://www.gtr1400.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,27.msg910.html#msg910
Richard
Quote from: Lonewolf on June 13, 2013, 10:11:23 PM
Debs, maybe its time to let 'Baby' go to the big workshop in the sky. :whistling:
Steve .... How could you say such a callous thing !! :no: :no:
Quote from: Rusty on June 13, 2013, 10:34:05 PM
Steve .... How could you say such a callous thing !! :no: :no:
:agree: Rusty.. That was a nasty thing to say when baby is poorly.. :nono:
What was the last thing you altered/replaced/modified before it all wemt wromh?
Have you been riding in the rain or had something happen to get the switches wet? Water seeping in past the flash-to-pass button has been known to cause some of these symptoms.
Quote from: Richard on June 13, 2013, 10:24:22 PM
When you say indicators stuck on you mean just alight, no flashing?
All of them?
Is that the realy that was buzzing?
Which one is it looking at
http://www.gtr1400.co.uk/forums/index.php/topic,27.msg910.html#msg910
Richard
Yes they stay on, but not the extra LED ones I fitted dont, BUT they do flash when I select left or right on the switch..
Yes I did remove the one that was buzzing.. Are supposed to buzz?
Her's a pic of the relay.. It is 1 of 2.. The other is for the main beam.
27002A - CHKM206679 - RELAY-ASSY - £20.46
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 10:56:54 PM
:agree: Rusty.. That was a nasty thing to say when baby is poorly.. :nono:
Sometimes you just have to let them go! :popcorn:
Quote from: Burchy on June 13, 2013, 11:05:15 PM
What was the last thing you altered/replaced/modified before it all wemt wromh?
The last thing I fitted was the extra lights on the rear, but they are not effected..
Quote from: jonathan on June 13, 2013, 11:09:06 PM
Have you been riding in the rain or had something happen to get the switches wet? Water seeping in past the flash-to-pass button has been known to cause some of these symptoms.
Yes I have but I always do.. Im not a fair weather rider. :popcorn:
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 11:20:57 PM
Yes they stay on, but not the extra LED ones I fitted dont, BUT they do flash when I select left or right on the switch..
Yes I did remove the one that was buzzing.. Are supposed to buzz?
Her's a pic of the relay.. It is 1 of 2.. The other is for the main beam.
27002A - CHKM206679 - RELAY-ASSY - £20.46
If the 2 relays are the same, same part number, then you can swap them over and see what happens: -
a/ if the fault is still there and the relay in the same position still buzzes then the relay is not the problem, its a consequence of the problem.
b/ if the relay that buzzed still buzzes in its new position then its faulty
Richard
Quote from: Richard on June 13, 2013, 11:37:24 PM
If the 2 relays are the same, same part number, then you can swap them over and see what happens: -
a/ if the fault is still there and the relay in the same position still buzzes then the relay is not the problem, its a consequence of the problem.
b/ if the relay that buzzed still buzzes in its new position then its faulty
Richard
Good thinking batman.. I will try that first.. :yes:
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 11:52:00 PM
Good thinking batman.. I will try that first.. :yes:
:mfr_lol: go for it Robin
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 11:20:57 PM
Yes they stay on, but not the extra LED ones I fitted dont, BUT they do flash when I select left or right on the switch..
Yes I did remove the one that was buzzing.. Are supposed to buzz?
You have 2 faults, dip lights and indicators, as they both appeared at the same time this suggests a common cause, my first guess would be an earth fault, but the indicators staying on would suggest a short somewhere between the circuits.
Assuming its not the relay when you try I would: -
Pull the fuses feeding dip head lights and indicators - see if everything else works ok
If it does put one fuse back and see results, try the other, write stuff down and report back.
Relays should just click when energised, not buzz.
Richard
Relays should just click when energised, not buzz.
Richard
[/quote]
+1 :agree:
Hi Debs, Had a problem in torrential rain once with the high beam lighting on its own, turned out to be waterlogged headlamp dip switch, remove clean and replace with lots of WD40 or the like. This is more likely than relays which rarely play up.
Quote from: Debs on June 13, 2013, 11:23:06 PM
Yes I have but I always do.. Im not a fair weather rider. :popcorn:
Just to clarify, I am suggesting that if you have ridden in the rain or washed your bike in the last couple of days there may be water in the flash-to-pass switch which is causing a minor short circuit. The solution may be as simple as drying the switch out.
OK thank you guys... Tomorrow is going to be a nice day so will try all solutions...
If I can't get it sorted then BK will have to do it as she is in for MOT on Wednesday..
Quote from: Richard on June 13, 2013, 11:37:24 PM
If the 2 relays are the same, same part number, then you can swap them over and see what happens: -
a/ if the fault is still there and the relay in the same position still buzzes then the relay is not the problem, its a consequence of the problem.
b/ if the relay that buzzed still buzzes in its new position then its faulty
Richard
:agree:
MGvalerio. :cool:
Quote from: Debs on June 14, 2013, 06:21:48 PM
OK thank you guys... Tomorrow is going to be a nice day so will try all solutions...
If I can't get it sorted then BK will have to do it as she is in for MOT on Wednesday..
Good Luck Deb's fingers crossed for you....and baby
Well I have looked at it today... I swapped the relays over and its not doing it now.. Problem is I dont think its the fault as both relays are ok.. I stripped out the tool box to get to the wires to the extra lights I fitted.. Checked them all and all ok... Also checked the fuses incase there was a dodgy one.
Im going on a ride out on Monday for a biker that was killed in the area... I will see how the lights are then.. If the problem persists then BK will have to sort them on Wednesday as I don't have a clue where to now check.. :hammer:
Quote from: Lonewolf on June 13, 2013, 11:21:21 PM
Sometimes you just have to let them go! :popcorn:
Steven, your heart is made of stone :yes: :whistling:
Quote from: 100milesaway on June 15, 2013, 08:08:50 PM
Steven, your heart is made of stone :yes: :whistling:
If I had the money I would px her for a new one..
Quote from: 100milesaway on June 15, 2013, 08:08:50 PM
Steven, your heart is made of stone :yes: :whistling:
I don't have a heart. :mfr_lol:
Quote from: Debs on June 15, 2013, 09:06:12 PM
If I had the money I would px her for a new one..
You can have mine
Quote from: Lonewolf on June 15, 2013, 10:02:22 PM
You can have mine
Dont even have the money to buy yours.. :sad:
Quote from: Debs on June 15, 2013, 03:11:03 PM
Well I have looked at it today... I swapped the relays over and its not doing it now.. Problem is I dont think its the fault as both relays are ok..
Maybe the flash-to-pass switch has now dried out?
- i don't think that it is the relay. A relay will rarely ever be stuck in a closed circuit position (ie , stuck live).
- what is more likely is the wiring/switches which drive that relay.
- guess : your wiring for the extra lights has grounded something.
- My local kwak dealer swears something awful when a bike comes in with electrical faults and is equipped with aftermarket lights , leds , blinkers , strobes , hids , etc.
.
I have checked all the fuses, relays, changed the head light bulbs and also disconnected all the extra lights..
She's off in to BK tomorrow for MOT and will have the lights fixed then.... :sad:
I have removed the panniers and the wiring looms to the extra lights.. The problem still exists. :censored: :hammer:
I put baby away in the garage, turned ignition off all the way to lock steering and the blue main beam light, green indicator lights and indicators were all stuck on.. Now im thinking, is it an ignition fault OR the relay at the rear.. [see pic]
When I had switched off the ignition the relays at the front were buzzing and the big relay at the back buzzed of 2/3 seconds..
A new relay will be £80.83 :sad:
I just hope its not the ignition switch as that comes in at £603.77 :sad:
Good luck with Baby tomorrow D....
I still think its waterlogged switches.
Quote from: Ubertours on June 18, 2013, 10:18:02 PM
I still think its waterlogged switches.
Needs a hair drier.
Alan
Quote from: Ubertours on June 18, 2013, 10:18:02 PM
I still think its waterlogged switches.
I dont think so... She's 4 years old and Ive owned her for 2.. I ride all year round and Ive ridden her through some torrential storms in that time and never had a problem..
Ive not done anything different than before.
Debs,
A long time ago, I had the problem with the headlight pass switch, which I had to take apart, clean (due to bi-metallic corrosion) and put back together with some lightweight "modelling" electrical grease. but the problem was they didn't work. Its only a couple of posidrive screws, and its not even a micro switch inside. It might definitely be worth taking apart as the 2010 models have an extra shield to protect the switchgear.
Neil
Quote from: SirToU on June 18, 2013, 11:49:52 PM
Debs,
A long time ago, I had the problem with the headlight pass switch, which I had to take apart, clean (due to bi-metallic corrosion) and put back together with some lightweight "modelling" electrical grease. but the problem was they didn't work. Its only a couple of posidrive screws, and its not even a micro switch inside. It might definitely be worth taking apart as the 2010 models have an extra shield to protect the switchgear.
Neil
Thanks Neil but she's now at BK.. I will let you know the outcome later.
Well lights are all sorted.. The problem was the mass of earth wires causing it.. I need to route them all to the main frame and not on brackets that are bolted on to brackets that then go to the frame...
Now for the other problem... Baby is still in bits in BK.. The Rear Subframe bracket had broken because of lifting baby on to the center stand using the pannier guard. It would have to come off to be welded but there's no saying it will be ok afterwards.. So Ive ordered one off fleabay for £70 as a new one is £547.32..
MOT runs out today so got no choice than for BK to do it..
My poor baby.. (http://www.desismileys.com/smileys/desismileys_4529.gif) (http://www.desismileys.com/)
Well at least you didn't have to pay out fortunes to get it sorted, ok the dealer will want some cash but soon enough it will be back home and you will be happy.
Every now and again you have to dig deep, this is your time.
Alan
Hi D, just think. it could have been a lot more costly. I must remember not to use the cage bars myself.
Yes I suppose it could have been.. The Labour costs are gong to be high :sad:
Yes note to all who have the bars... Do not use it to lift your bike on to center stand. :nono:
BK did say the bike can be left on the side stand and does not have to go on the center stand.. :clap:
Quote from: Debs on June 19, 2013, 07:43:58 PM
Yes note to all who have the bars... Do not use it to lift your bike on to center stand. :nono:
I find this puzzling, as these bars are supposed to protect the bike if you drop it, but they can't be subjected to any stress?
:agree: indeed.
Quote from: jonathan on June 20, 2013, 03:30:02 PM
I find this puzzling, as these bars are supposed to protect the bike if you drop it, but they can't be subjected to any stress?
It's not the bars.. Its the :shit: bracket that's welded on to the rear subframe thats not strong enough..
- same thing.
- ie , the bars' chosen mounts are inappropriate for the job.
.
Yup, that bracket that the crash bars are attached to were not designed to have crash bars attached to them.
Chances are, with you lifting the bike onto the centrestand you have been either pulling or more likely twisting the bracket in a direction it was never designed to be pulled or twisted.
These days they design all these brackets and attachments to do their job with maybe a 10% margin on top.
They do this because it keeps weight and costs down.
If they designed them like Brunel did then they would never break, but the bikes would be £25k and weigh 500Kg.
I use the grab rail to lift it onto the centre stand, but then again, I don't use the centre stand very often. The bike moves onto it quite easily as you would expect when I apply my weight to the lever...
The first time I put the 1400 onto its centrestand I damned near threw the bike out of the garage.
It slid at least 2 feet backwards on the stand,..... on carpet (yes, I have a carpeted garage,... with UNDERLAY! :punk:)
I was used to HEAVING the GTR1000 onto it's stand and the 1400 by contrast is an absolute doddle.
Perhaps it's a weight thing again as with my weight on the stand I can use my fingertips under the grabrail to lift it onto the stand.
I found it very difficult to get it on the center stand, thats why I was lifting using the guard. I just dont have the strength otherwise.
I did ask BK if its ok to just use the side stand. All the bikes in their showroom are on the side stands and it will be ok for mine to...
They only use the center stand when on the ramp to do repairs..
Expensive lesson learnt.. :sad:
When you do use the centre stand I would suggest leaving it in gear so that it won't roll forward off the stand.
You're not alone Deb's - I too have great difficulty getting the bike onto the centre stand - there has to be knack as I didn't have any problems with my 480kg Goldwing....
Quote from: jonathan on June 24, 2013, 05:17:28 PM
When you do use the centre stand I would suggest leaving it in gear so that it won't roll forward off the stand.
I always leave her in gear. I stop the engine by dropping the side stand while in gear.
Quote from: PCPeteUK on June 24, 2013, 05:27:27 PM
You're not alone Deb's - I too have great difficulty getting the bike onto the centre stand - there has to be knack as I didn't have any problems with my 480kg Goldwing....
Maybe we are just weaklings.. :mfr_lol:
Quote from: PCPeteUK on June 24, 2013, 05:27:27 PM
You're not alone Deb's - I too have great difficulty getting the bike onto the centre stand - there has to be knack as I didn't have any problems with my 480kg Goldwing....
It actually is a combination of pulling on the handle bar with your left hand and pushing on the stand down and forward with your right foot that does the trick.
That way you can use your whole body weight to make it easier.
And it helps to take her out of gear first. :whistling:
The main problem is that there is no good place to hold on to with your right hand at the back except for the carrier frame.
And that is too far back to pull the bike up at the same time unless you are a giant.
I guess that is why Debs was using the cage in the first place.
- re the center stand thing : its all technique.
- point of reference : I am 55 kgs (121 lbs) and 5'8".
- and I can get it onto the center stand , even when the bike is loaded down for touring.
- if emaciated me can do it , you fellas (and ladies) surely can.
.
It's a piece of :censored:
Technique is what it is, left hand on handlebar, right foot on centre stand, right hand on rear bar above where the pannier would go, then in one movement pull up on the right hand, pull rear on the left hand and press down with your foot.
There endeth today's lesson.
Alan
I just wont bother :mfr_lol:
Side stand for me :mfr_lol: :popcorn:
Debs, You should have said when I last saw you.
Its all about technique. but 100 people can tell you how to do it, its also just finding the way it works for you. my other half had the same problem and I must have given her the same instructions 50 times (as well as everyone else telling her how to do it), one day, I said it another slightly different way - and she got it. job done.
perhaps next time.
Neil.....
Perhaps there is a difference between the 2008/9 model and the 2010+ model?
Like Boomer said, I find it dead easy to stick on the centre stand. In fact, the first time I did it I was surprised considering the weight. I didn't quite throw the bike out of the garage though :mfr_lol:
Why don't we have a video competition - everyone video themselves putting the bike on the centre stand. Points go for most amusing vids and distance bike is thrown backwards... :death: :popcorn: :mfr_lol:
Ros
Quote from: Ros on June 26, 2013, 12:09:27 PM
Perhaps there is a difference between the 2008/9 model and the 2010+ model?
Like Boomer said, I find it dead easy to stick on the centre stand. In fact, the first time I did it I was surprised considering the weight. I didn't quite throw the bike out of the garage though :mfr_lol:
Why don't we have a video competition - everyone video themselves putting the bike on the centre stand. Points go for most amusing vids and distance bike is thrown backwards... :death: :popcorn: :mfr_lol:
Ros
:mfr_lol: :mfr_lol:
YAY I got baby back.. :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
:sweet: all sorted?
Interesting thread and pleased you have your baby back debs.
Got to admit that side stand does not look very industrial and I always worry about leaving the bike on it. The fact that no one has reported / discussed a side stand failure they must be robust and I should stop worrying :yes:
Quote from: Richard on June 26, 2013, 07:29:35 PM
:sweet: all sorted?
Yes Richard.. All done.. BK said the Rear Subframe I had bought off ebay looked almost new, even though it was from a A8F 2008 model.. Just now need to spend all weekend re connecting all my extras on better earth points..
Quote from: Alfor on June 26, 2013, 07:30:09 PM
Interesting thread and pleased you have your baby back debs.
Got to admit that side stand does not look very industrial and I always worry about leaving the bike on it. The fact that no one has reported / discussed a side stand failure they must be robust and I should stop worrying :yes:
Yes you do need to stop worrying.. :mfr_lol:
Why don't you run a substantial earth loom around the bike you can add you bits to
Quote from: trousersnake01 on June 26, 2013, 09:23:28 PM
Why don't you run a substantial earth loom around the bike you can add you bits to
Thats what I'm going to do Bob.. :yes:
I've always created a central "star" earth point on all my vehicles.
This neatly avoids the risk of creating an earth loop that can cause all kinds of strange behaviour.
On the 1400 I added a fusebox so I created a nice big earth point right next to it that has a 30Amp capable wire that connects it to the Battery -ve terminal.
All accessories connect to the fusebox for their =ve and the "star" earth for their negative.